Did Jesus exist in the beginning with God?
avatar

Print Friendly

I have been a follower of Jesus for years and have spent a lot of time reading His Word, so I sometimes forget that not everybody knows the basic beleifs of Christianity. I take it for granted that people just believe the stuff every Christian should know.

Take for example this simple question, “Did Jesus exist in the beginning with God?” Before anything was created, before time, did Jesus exist in the beginning? I asked sixteen professing believers I work with this question, and was shocked at how few knew the answer.  Twelve of those sixteen did not believe that Jesus existed in the beginning, and was just the first created thing.

Did Jesus exist in the beginning?

John 1:1-2 simply states this when it says

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God.

And who was the Word? Just a few verses later John clearly tells us

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.
John bore witness of Him and cried out, saying, “This was He of whom I said, ‘He who comes after me is preferred before me, for He was before me.’” (John 1:14-15)

Who was it that became flesh to dwell among us, the only begotten of the Father (John 3:16)? Who was it that John bore witness to? It was Jesus. Jesus existed in the beginning with God, and not just existing with God, but Jesus was God in the beginning! (He is still God today of course. :) )

Isaiah the prophet heard a message from God where God the Father said

Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel, And his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: ‘ I am the First and I am the Last; Besides Me there is no God. (Isaiah 44:6)

God is the First and the Last, nothing existed before God and nothing will exist after Him, He is it, the first and the last. In Revelation Jesus identifies himself as ” I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.” (Revelation 22:13) The Alpha and Omega are the first and last letters of the greek alphabet, in English it would be the A and the Z. There are no letters before A, and none after Z. Jesus is the first and last, the beginning, and the end.

How is it that both God the Father and Jesus can be the first and the last? This is only possible because Jesus is God. Remember what John 1:1 said, “The Word was with God, and the Word was God.” Both are God, both are one being, one diety, even though they are individual.

I Am

In the Old Testament God would refer to himself as simply “I Am” (Exodus 3:14). That in itself is an awesome statement, which I will cover in a future article. Jesus later when talking to the Jews told them “Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”” (John 8:58). Jesus is not only saying that he existed since before his physical birth on earth, but he is identifying himself as being God, as being the I Am. Jesus again identified himself as the I am when he was being arrested in the garden. The soldiers asked if Jesus was “Jesus of Nazareth” and Jesus replied in such away that the soldiers fell to the ground. “Now when He said to them, “I am He,” they drew back and fell to the ground.” (John 18:6)

Jesus is the Creator

When God is creating man He says “Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness;” (Genesis 1:26). Who is God talking to here? Who is God refereing to by saying “Us” and “Our”? God is not a single being but three, completely seperate beings, three deities that are the same. The Word was with God and the Word was God (John 1:1). This is an example of how Jesus did exist in the beginning.

Not only was Jesus with God in the beginning, before creation, but Jesus is the creator. John 1:3 says “All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.” Jesus did not come to die for his Father’s creation, but his own. Isn’t this amazing? Jesus knew what he would have to go through, he knew all of the suffering he would face before he created us, yet he still choose to do so!

Why is this important?

The final question I want to look at is why is it important that Jesus existed in the beginning with God?
If Jesus did not exist in the beginning with God, then you must conclude that Jesus was not God and therefor could not live a perfect life and die for our sins, or you must conclude that God can make other gods. If God could make other gods then it makes God a lot less unique in the universe and we could claim that there are other gods to follow and Jesus isn’t the only way.

No, Jesus had to be God, part of the Trinity, One God.  As we read and study the Bible, and as we get to know Jesus closer, we cannot help but conclude that Jesus did indeed exist in the beginning with God.

About Jon Zenor

Jon is the founder and leader of ETM, a ministry dedicated to sharing the gospel across the Internet. You can find more information about him on his personal website, JonZenor.com.
Who is God?, , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , Permalink

43 Responses to Did Jesus exist in the beginning with God?

  1. Did Jesus exist in the beginning with God?: I have been a follower of Jesus for years and have spent a lot of ti… http://bit.ly/jQPQZ9

  2. Steven Rivera says:

    Very good article! May God continue to bless you.

  3. Jon Zenor says:

    Thank you for the comment Steven. I am glad you enjoyed the article. :)

  4. Pingback: JonZ (@JonZenor)

  5. Pingback: JonZ (@JonZenor)

  6. Allison says:

    Thank you very much for this. It was a pleasure to study on this after skipping through many websites denying Jesus as God.
    “And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that [spirit] of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.” (1 John 4:3)

  7. Maycol says:

    Very well explained brother!

  8. FELIPE DIAZ says:

    I agree that the scripture says that jesus is god’s word and that god is plural when he created man ( male and female ) and that everything came into being through god’s word since he said and it was done. but to think that jesus as such existed with god seems to me like something from the urantia book. I have to dwell into the word more :)

    • JDH says:

      Hi Felipe,
      Thanks for your post.
      This is a heady topic, no?

      You said:
      “but to think that jesus as such existed with god seems to me like something from the urantia book. I have to dwell into the word more…”

      Amen brother. It is always good to go back to the Word.

      It seems maybe you’re struggling with the ‘as such.’ I’m assuming the ‘as such’ references the way we find Jesus in the Gospels. If that was what Jon was claiming in his article, I can understand the confusion. But I don’t think that is the case.

      If your struggle is with finding Jesus as we find him in the Gospels, i.e. as a human, in the beginning before there were humans, I think I have an answer for you.

      If you look at John 1:14, you have the key: The Word became Flesh.

      The Word is the identity of Christ before the “incarnation,” a fancy theological term for the act of the Son of God (2nd Person of the Trinity) becoming human while retaining his deity.

      Jesus wasn’t as he is now in the beginning with God. He submitted to the Father and took on human nature, not a fallen, flawed human nature, but a sinless one.

      He endured a human life, died a human death and rose from the grave–all to obey the Father’s will.
      But when the Father Raised him and Glorified him, Jesus didn’t go back to being like he was before the incarnation, because the incarnation was/is permanent.

      So, yes, Jesus was with God in the beginning, but as the Logos. He hadn’t taken on humanness yet.
      There is a Trinity, but the Son of God, he changed forever at his conception in the womb of Mary. Today He sits at the right hand of God, as the God-Man. This is one of the key mysteries of the faith that no one understands fully.
      However, if you want to see the idea that Jesus is God and man brought out as fact by John the Baptist and Jesus himself, keep reading the Gospel of John.

      You don’t need the Urantia book, because this extraordinary mystery is in the Bible.

  9. Brian Wright says:

    Jesus is god there is no trinity John 1:1 clearly states that jesus was in the beginning with god but only in the mind of god thats why adam and eve didnt catch god off guard when they sinned because god had a plan since the beginning. Jesus was conceived of the holy spirit and brought forth by mary (woman) the only holy spirit we know in the OT is god (yaweh) so for anyone to say they are different and god was with jesus in the beginning needs to rightly divide the word of truth and get that revelation of who jesus christ really is

    • Jon Zenor says:

      Only in the mind of God? Where is that ever in scripture? And how do you rectify that point of view compared to the other points I brought up in this article?

    • JDH says:

      Hi Brian,
      Thanks for your post. Your claims made me curious to understand more about where you’re coming from.

      From my church background, the Trinity is a basic Christian concept and John 1:1-18 is one of the classic proof texts for it.

      Did you mean to say Jesus was a thought in God’s mind before Creation, because God is all knowing?

      If that is not the case, my apologies for misunderstanding. Posts leave out the human element so much of the time. If you would, I’d enjoy hearing what you meant to communicate.

      If that is the case, and you interpret John 1:1-18 is teaching that Jesus was a thought in God’s mind, would you share with everyone the method you used to interpret John 1:1-18 this way?

  10. Great article! Amen! He was with God in the beginning, and was God. He became flesh and dwelt among us! The Gospel of John declares the deity of the Son through the entire book! In 1 John he goes on to say, anyone that denies the Father and the Son is that spirit of the anti-Christ. When one denies the very trues of scripture and teaches the WORD was just a thought in Gods mind, they are really denying Jesus of his deity. He now has become just a plan in Gods mind. I say let God be true and every man a liar. The truth is the Son has always been and always will be! The book of Hebrews declares = But of the Son , He (Father) says, Thy throne oh God is forever and ever! Great article man!

    • Jon Zenor says:

      Thanks Joey! :)

      You are not related to Erik Galloway by chance are you? Glad you found my blog. Feel free to subscribe and get our new articles delivered via email.

  11. Mark says:

    We know that God said that he created Man and Women in his image but he said “In OUR Image”. To me that proves that Jesus pre-existed according to Genesis. One Hebrew word for Go is Elohim , which to my understanding is Uni-Plural. Singular in the fact that it means a Group thus One Group, Plural in the sense that perhaps God was taking to Jesus and Himself at creation. We know from the Gospel of John that Jesus stated that No one has seen the Father except he who is from the Father. The New Testament also states in various places that Jesus was God come in the flesh. Any thoughts on this matter.

    P.S. I have a copy of the Complete Jewish Bible which helped me reach my conclusion along with prayer.

  12. Rachel says:

    Hi, Jon
    Your blog has been very helpful to me! I’m involved in spiritual debates with a Mormon friend and your resources are very useful. Thanks!

  13. Michelle says:

    I am a christian but I often get very confused and cannot comprehend the idea of how Christ was there from the beginning (which I believe he was), but I just cannot rap my head around it. I believe in the bible with my whole heart. There is no other God I wish to serve. I just get scared sometimes since I do not understand the trinity but I do believe in it, is it okay that my mind is not able to comprehend God’s amazing love and amazing grace or comprehend that Christ and the holy spirit are separate from the father but also one?

    • Jon Zenor says:

      Michelle,

      Understanding the nature of God is, well, impossible. It is fun and humbling to study the nature of God, but at some point we need to realize that God is totally beyond comprehension and we just need to accept what is revealed about Him in the Word of God.

  14. Wanda says:

    Thank you so much for this explanation. It makes so much sense to me. I just recently started studying the bible and I have been stuck on Gen 1:26 and John 1:1-2.

  15. EDEM says:

    TRULY JESUS IS God and existed from beginning. Thats why He His God

  16. john lebeoa says:

    thank you for these very helpful words. i believe jesus do exist before time. because he is the word and throught words(prural) the world is made. confirms the ‘let us’make man into our own image.
    by the way, let me ask these question; if jesus claimed to be the son of god is ‘word’ is that mean that father of word(jesus) is THOUGHT? (because “word” comes out from thought)

    • Jon Zenor says:

      I do not think that “thought” is God… God is an actual being, not just a thought. Also I do not think that Jesus being called the “Word” is a litteral word.

  17. benjamin says:

    i am a christian but i don not share in the trinity.God is one and that cant be disputed.what is disputable is when we say there are 3 distinct personality in one GOD.we make God 3 while claiming he is still one.this belief was not held by the early church.Jesus came to grant us eternal life by reconciling us to God almighty he never intended to get us confused of who he is.let this be clearly stated that the WORD of God (also christ the son)proceeded forth and came(sent by God) from GOD into this world in flesh that he may be able to wash away the sins of the world by shedding his blood as a holy sacrifice once and for all. he is the word of God that never goes and come back to God unaccomplished.A servant can is not greater than his master neither can the son be equal with the father which bigot him.Just as christ made it clear that the father is greater than he is and all he does is not of his own initiative but that of the father that sent him.he made this clear to us in order to abolish any confusion that may arise in future.lets not deceive our selves with mysteries that do not really exist for it is not the will of God to get so confused about knowing who is. One of the reasons Jesus came to simplify the essence of knowing God and not to make it difficult for the human mind to grasp.the WORD existed in the begining with God and the word is GOD is very correct in the sense that it is of the substance from God sent fort to accomplish GODS will in creating the world and also becoming flesh to reconcile man to God.the word can not do anything on his own unless it is sent by the father who is all in all.therefore the word is subject to the divine authority of God almighty as it is moved by the holy spirit which is the everlasting power of GOD.The WORD is not really distinct from the spirit they are one substance of the father.John 3:34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him. No wonder jesus said in John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.”.therefore the son of God (the word of God) is spirit.the fact that Jesus is a divine substance from GOD does not make him equal with the almighty GOD himslf .simply put Jesus is the word of God personified and was with God before the world was created. the fact that Jesus existed with God before the foundation of the world could also mean that he was the first of all Gods creation set aside to accomplish Gods will and purpose.For it pleased God to put all things under his feet in order to bring Glory to himself the father.think of this if Jesus is GOD then his name would have been greater than any other name from the begining and so there wont be any need for God Almighty to now exalt and bestow him with a name that is greater than any other name after he had completed the redemption work.the bible states that though jesus being in form of God did NOT count equality with God and was humble till death.it shows clearly that Jesus knowing fully that he being a substance from God almighty did not claim equality with God as we are doing for him because he is humble and doing so would be misleading.
    logically speaking if we say jesus is the word of God that means he existed with God and has no begining since Gods word has always being inside God and is a part of God but not GOD in his fullness but as we know nothing is imposible with GOD. we still need to ask ourslves this questions
    What PART of GOD Is Not GOD?
    Is there any PART of GOD that Is Not GOD?
    How much of GOD Is Not GOD?
    answer.judging by this fact it can also be said that when jesus is speaking it is God that is speaking but onething should be clear for it is said that in the begining was the word and the word was with God and the word was God.this has obviousely proven that the word of God was set aside and personified by God for the fulfilment of his works since without the word was nothing made that was made then is clear that GoD SET aside his word and used it to creat the worlds by his power and authority.THE WORD CAN DO NOTHING ON HIS OWN.It would have been possible for God to send an angel to accomplish the task of reconciling man to himself but even the angels are not perfect for some of them have also fallen short of his glory .therefore the his WORD personified was to be the perfect tool and sacrifice to ACCOMPLISH BOTH TASK. the WORD bears withness to all that the father has been doing because it started with him who is the first of Gods creation before he reincarnated in the flesh TO SAVE MAN
    A simple analogy is this, the words we speak are meant to show our intentions and aspirations which are put fort into action in order accomplish what we want be it physical or otherwise. ours words are a semblance form of who we are and not necessarily us in complete entity because we direct and control what we say and want to say therefore if our words are personified by taking a human form and sent forth it will do and act the same way as we would.Nevertheless it will still obey and recognize the master from whom it proceeded from and would never deem it right to claim equality with him because he alone has the authority and power to send and direct it as he pleases.the word must go and must accomplish what it was sent for before reporting to the one who sent it.It will be impossible for our words to just jump out of our mouth without the expression decision of us to speak it out.for before a person speaks he must first agree withing himself before utering any word.threfore the words can do nothing of his own unless by the express authority of the owner saying and sending it forth
    Isa 55:11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.
    jesus said in john 8 verse 43
    Jesus said to them, If God were your Father, you would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
    The Acts of the Apostles in the Bible details the activity of the disciples over a period of thirty years after Jesus was lifted up to heaven. Throughout this period they never refer to Jesus as God. They continually and consistently use the title God to refer to someone else other than Jesus.
    Peter stood up with the eleven disciples and addressed the crowd saying:“Men of Israel, listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you yourselves know.”(Acts 2:22).
    Jesus as saying:“…the Father is greater than I.”(John 14:28).
    Jesus as saying:“By myself I can do nothing…”(John 5:30).
    Toady asked: then who was he?
    Timothy 2:5: “For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus”
    lets consider another verse posted by JESUS IS:
    Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through Me. If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; from now on you know Him, and have seen Him.” Philip said to Him, “Lord, show us the Father, and it is enough for us.” Jesus said to him, “Have I been so long with you, and yet you have not come to know Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how do you say,’Show us the Father’?” (John 14:6-9)
    there is not a single unequivocal statement in the bible where jesus christ says that I am God, he has always talked about the father the one and only God in the heaven.
    “…you are determined to kill me, a man who has told you the truth that I heard from God.”(John 8:40).this is very important to note.what the prophets and apostles wrote about jesus before and after his coming might have been wrongly interpreted to mean that jesus christ is God almighty.but it would better for us to listen carefully of what jesus said about himself and what he wants us to know about the father that sent him below are excertpts from the bible
    to conclude any man who is willing to know who jesus is in relationship to God should just go and read because it explains everything

    Then cometh the end, when he (Christ) shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; and when all things shall be subdued unto him (Christ) , then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him (God the Father) that put all things under him, that God may be all in all” (I Cor. 15:24, 28).

    Look at the word “subject.”

    The word “subject” in the verse above is “hupotasso” in the Greek (#5293 in Strong’s Concordance) , and means ” subordinate…to be under obedience .” The root word is “hupo” (#5259 Strong’s) and means ” beneath…in an inferior position .” The Council of Nicea (325 A.D.) declared that Jesus is “co-equal” with God, but the apostle Paul did not know that. He says that Jesus will live eternally “subject” (subordinate, under obedience, and in an inferior position to) God the Father. The Scriptures clearly teach that Jesus has been appointed, anointed, empowered and ordained to build a kingdom and rule over it for 1000 years. But at the end of the millennium he will lay the kingdom at God the Father’s feet .

    • Jon Zenor says:

      As this entire topic goes completely against our statement of beliefs I will not be participating in it. Spending our time debating online is never beneficial to either party. Plus your comments about Jesus not being God really undermines the entire Christian faith.

  18. The Experience says:

    YES Jesus was a Thought in God’s mind Where in the Scripture you ask? 1PETER1:18-21. Look at verse 20 it tells you alot about Jesus. Yes Brian Wright got it right; very few people know this because they are being told a lie. Trinity that’s a lie also you will not find nothing about the trinity in the bible, not even the term WHY, because Trinity is a Catholic term that Man came up with. Oh and the Us in Genesis that’s an easy one to answer Look at WISDOM OF SOLOMON CHAPTER 9:9; this tells you who God was talking too. You have too look this up online if you don’t have it in your bible. Jon Zenor I’m not trying to be mean but I just wanted to state the bible’s opinions Never my own opinions because I leave that at the door everytime I open The Holy Book of Scriptures. If you want to know more just reply back to me. Godbless :)

  19. george eves says:

    god cannot die ,so how could jesus be god . infact any one who believes jesus was god tecnically denies jesus came inthe flesh,;which is the anti christ for that reason god cannot die , if god died as jesus , and part of his spirit lived on then he could not of paid the price for the remmissin of sins ,the whole senario would of been a farce ,meaninless,//

  20. george eves says:

    god cannot ,die ,how could jesus possibly be god;

  21. george eves says:

    if jesus was god it technically denies ,he came in the flesh , which is the antichrist , becuse god cannot die , if jesus was god and part of him ;his spirit remained alive ,the he could not have paid the remmision for sin , the whole episode would be a farce;;

  22. Daisy says:

    Thank you may GOD bless you . It is now pretty explicit I have this question for some time thanks for answering . Now one question: is it okay to have graven images of Christ even though it says not to in the first commandments ???

  23. Daisy says:

    I think that when Jesus says he is the Word that. He is saying that only by Him can we enter enternal life bc we usually call the Bible the Word of GOD meaning our guidance n Jesus says He is our Shepherd Who leads us to righteousness
    And we our his sheep ; His followers of the Word :the Truth

    • Jon Zenor says:

      Hey Daisy, actually we don’t call the Bible the Word of God to mean guidance, but because we believe scripture, all of it, to be inspired and breathed by God. So it is literally the Word of God.

      But other than that, yes, we are the sheep and He is our Shepard.

  24. Thomas Rad says:

    Paul and Peter state in their epistles……”Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Messiah”! If Jehovah is this God they are referring to, then how on earth can Jesus be equal to this God? Jesus mentions this same God and Father many times in Revelations as well!

  25. dnol says:

    Thanks all for your post. I believe Jesus existed before the beginning. I see the different phases/stages of the manifestations of Jesus(Word)
    1. Before the beginning of creation
    2. at creation
    3. after creation
    4. at redemption

    Can we explain these further? Jesus is called the Word of God. To me God(the Father) is not God without the word(Jesus) because He spoke the word out of Himself. Therefore the Word(Jesus) was inside of Him(God the Father).
    Jesus also said that the Father is Spirit. He also said the Word that He spake is spirit. To me the Word is Spirit, The Father i Spirit therefore the Spirit is the Word.

    Can we conclude by saying that the Father is the Word, the Spirit is the Word, and Jesus is the Word. I see the Word existing in different instances and phases.
    Correct me if i am wrong. but our concern now is to bring out the importance of the word t us today and how does the word exist in our lives, can we say that the Holy spirit is the word existing in our lives today?

  26. doug ikerd says:

    God is great and I believe in the trinity, I know our Jesus came down here from his kingdom, and died on the cross for mine and the whole worlds sins. he must love us so much. and after we did to him what we did, he still sits on the right hand side of Gods throne, and makes intercessions for us. I really enjoyed your post, thank you.

  27. EJK says:

    IN GOD’S MIND : Jesus, that is Christadelphian’s belief, that He was in God’s mind, and Jesus is only existant from his birth as God’s son, according to CD’s Jesus is the son of God and not God- I understand that Nicean council said that TRINITY was the Godhead, however prior to that I am not sure what christians were thinking. However I do believe that He existed from the beginning. Is God triune God ? not sure, but God acted in Jesus and acts in Holy Spirit.

    • Jon Zenor says:

      Jesus did not exist “only in God’s mind”… He existed in every sense except human. Jesus is the one who created everything, so yes, He existed. :)

  28. Abby James says:

    Amen! Wonderful explanation :-)

  29. Sheila says:

    Hi Jon, I am still new in Christ, so I don’t know the bible as well as others, but I get confused about John 1:1, because of other scriptures like Matthew 26:39 Jesus pray to the father. So my question is why do he pray to the father if he is God, why do he pray to himself? There are other scriptures where Jesus pray to God. I just don’t understand why God would pray to to himself?

    • Jon Zenor says:

      John 1:1 does not just say that God and Jesus are the same, but it also says they are separate. This is the great mystery of God, how can He be 3 persons and 1 at the same time? I don’t have an answer for you there. But if Jesus prayed to God, and they are the same, how much more important is it that WE pray to God?

  30. Hank Burns says:

    God is so superior to us and our minds that we cannot comprehend or understand all that had taken place or is in the Bible. Many people try to dispute the Bible and make their own theory but they are not trusting in God’s word. The word is very clear and God wants us to simply Believe, trust and have faith. His word and all writers of the Bible are very clear on how to live like Jesus ,

  31. DEB says:

    Jon,
    Both in your article, and on Jan 22nd, 2014 you stated that God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are separate from each other. That John 1:1 states separateness. I read John 1:1 and the word separate isn’t there. We know that God is a triune being. I am wondering: if we are made in His image, Spirit, Soul and Body, could it be possible that God is also Spirit (the Father), Soul (the Holy Spirit) and Body (Jesus)? We are also 3 entities – not separate – for one cannot exist without the other. We return to spirit when we die, as did Jesus, yet fully spirit, living in a body here on earth. If God also chose US before the foundation of the world, Eph 1:4, didn’t we, in some way, also exist with God as did Jesus? Even if we were just a ‘thought’ in the mind of God, did we then, somehow exist with Him at that time? I know this is heavy, but I could use your insight. Thanks

    • Jon Zenor says:

      DEB,

      Getting a message like this is a great way to start out my day, forcing me to focus on the Word.

      There is a place near where I live that is absolutely beautiful. I love to go there and take pictures. The problem is the photos that I take never seem to capture the beauty that I see with my eyes. If you look at the photograph I have taken (This photo, for example), you can get a general sense of the colors and the environment, but you don’t see everything that is beyond the frame of that photo. You can’t tell the exact depth between the elements within the photo. You can’t hear what I was hearing, smell what I was smelling, or even feel the temperature of the air or feel the relief of the sun warming my skin despite the cold air.

      In the same way, we are made in the image of God, simply a simple snapshot of the real thing. The analogy that you bring up of God being in the same way one physical being with three parts, spirit, body, and soul, is okay for a simplistic understanding of who God is, but it comes nowhere near close enough to describe who God really is. While Jesus was on earth in physical form the Father was still in heaven in His form, as was the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is here with us physically today, empowering and working through His church.

      Your application of Ephesians 1:4 is interesting, I have never heard that before. But I don’t believe it is entirely accurate. The phrase used “before the foundation of the world” can be used to help understand this. God didn’t just chose us and know us before, He also knew the world, what it would be like, what history it would have, how it would end. But does that mean it existed with God in the beginning too? It didn’t exist and neither did we. Jesus knew we *would* exist and to what capacity our lives would affect things, but we didn’t exist in the same sense that God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit existed before the beginning.

      I hope I helped you gain some understanding with this passage. Thank you for asking the question and challenging me this morning.

      – Jon

  32. josephine says:

    very well said. I have been contemplating on this issue. This was my question before.I’m so confused and had read one of the blog who said that the ‘us” refers to wisdom. Now I know.

    Thanks for this explanation.

Add Comment Register



Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

You may use these HTML tags and attributes: <a href="" title=""> <abbr title=""> <acronym title=""> <b> <blockquote cite=""> <cite> <code> <del datetime=""> <em> <i> <q cite=""> <strike> <strong>